Ep #18: The Unexpected Result of Giving Your Time and Money

Episode Transcript

Spencer
The resources that we have, our time, our money, the investments that we have, even our positions of influence. We have these for a short period of time. So let's make sure that we use them to build God's kingdom while we have them. We can think about it like this. It's as though we have Confederate currency towards the end of the Civil War.
We're not going to have that capability to use it for very long. We know that there's an end in sight, whether it's our lifetime or when the Lord returns. So we want to be able to utilize those resources because Jesus tells us, do not lay it for yourselves treasures on earth where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal.
So we want to use those to build the kingdom in the time that we have.

Austin
Absolutely. Thanks again for joining us on the Second Half Stewardship podcast. We're really glad that you're here. We're glad that you joined us and we're glad that you're listening again. You know, over the last couple of episodes, Spencer, we've been talking about the idea that God Owns relationships, and in the last episode we looked at 2 Timothy 2:1-2.
And just this idea that we really need to think about guiding others towards seeking and savoring Jesus. And today, as we continue this journey on God owning relationships, we want to think about is we can use both our time and our money to enhance those relationships. So when we think about that, God is generous with us. He has provided for us.
He owns all that we have. And so we want to be conduits of that. And the money that we have, the time that we have are ways that we can receive from the Lord and pass on to others. So maybe what's the difference between what the culture sees as how we can use time or money to enhance relationships?
Typically it comes down to using people and doing them, just making them do what we want them.

Spencer
I think as we consider the way our culture moves at this, it really comes back to the fall and we have a fear that we're not going to be in control of a lot of the outcomes that we want to see in our lives. We want control over people. We want control over situations. And so oftentimes we'll use money to manipulate things.
You think about this how we use money with our kids sometimes if these outcomes happen, then I will give you this. Or we think about how we some people might donate to charity. They say, okay, well, if you do it for A, B and C, then I'll give you these resources. Or we try to even do that in marriages, you know, okay, I'll do this.
If you do this, I will. We can use resources over here. If you'll use resources over here, it's it's this leverage that we try to use with resources and not that that's always an incorrect direction, but it rarely involves building God's kingdom. When we are thinking about controlling others, and particularly as we think about it in controlling to protect ourselves against some of these fears that come really from the fall.

Austin
When I think about anytime I try to control my kids, they're not that old right now. It doesn’t ever go well. It always ends with me frustrated with a child frustrated. Sadly, it ends with just brokenness. And I don't want that to continue. And so I think I need to constantly be reminded, you know, I've been thinking recently, okay, Lord, I trust you with my finances.
And one of my children was like, Well, you need to trust the Lord with us, too. He's not that old but it was just it hit me like a ton of bricks of like, Oh, it's really easy for me to trust the Lord in some places, but not trust the Lord with relationships. And it does come back to that control, comes back to that fear that they're not going to become the people that I want them to be.
So how can I use my money in a different way? And that's really hard for me. And so as we think about how we're going to look at this scripturally, we're going to take a look at Luke 16:1-9, and we're going to think about how do we use resources, physical or intangible, to enhance these relationships and advance the kingdom of God.
Using them in that discipleship means that we talked about last week as we're constantly guiding people to seek and savor Jesus.

Spencer
Where we're headed. Jesus has already set his face to Jerusalem. We're in Luke 16, so he's told the parable of the lost sheep, the lost coin, the prodigal son or the two sons, as we might look at there, and we're really seeing God pursuing his children in this and the joy at seeing his children come into a deeper relationship with him and walking with him.
And so that's a lot of the context of where we're looking at here. And then Jesus takes this next parable and really he frames it in such a way that we think about using resources to be able to enhance that. Because in Luke 15, we see Jesus talking about the prodigal Son and the Father, even though he's lost a third of his wealth to this prodigal son, you know, using it on prostitutes and such, he's not concerned about that.
He's concerned about the restoration of the relationship. And so we see that continued in the parable that Jesus now tells in Luke 16.

Austin
1 He also said to the disciples, “There was a rich man who had a manager, and charges were brought to him that this man was wasting his possessions. 2 And he called him and said to him, ‘What is this that I hear about you? Turn in the account of your management, for you can no longer be manager.’ 3 And the manager said to himself, ‘What shall I do, since my master is taking the management away from me? I am not strong enough to dig, and I am ashamed to beg. 4 I have decided what to do, so that when I am removed from management, people may receive me into their houses.’ 5 So, summoning his master’s debtors one by one, he said to the first, ‘How much do you owe my master?’ 6 He said, ‘A hundred measures of oil.’ He said to him, ‘Take your bill, and sit down quickly and write fifty.’ 7 Then he said to another, ‘And how much do you owe?’ He said, ‘A hundred measures of wheat.’ He said to him, ‘Take your bill, and write eighty.’ 8 The master commended the dishonest manager for his shrewdness. For the sons of this world are more shrewd in dealing with their own generation than the sons of light. 9 And I tell you, make friends for yourselves by means of unrighteous wealth, so that when it fails they may receive you into the eternal dwellings.
We're going to start off and just consider who are the characters here in this text. Well, first we've got a master and a steward, and then the people who are in debt to the master.
The master is seen and is noble, he's honorable. The steward is dishonest. So, you know, oftentimes Jesus will set up this contrast, who is honorable, who is dishonorable to show us and enlightened things about ourselves. And so that steward, he knows he can't manipulate his master. Like he does in his unrighteous dealings. The master fires the steward and the master demands that the steward turn in the books and he's the steward looking for his own future, creates a solution whereby he can be hired as another manager later.

Spencer
But oftentimes, as Jesus tells us, a parable, he will highlight someone who's noble and he will say, in effect, Look at what's done here, sometimes in an unusual way, but follow that person. You know, let's emulate that person or this person is he's pursuing the kingdom. But we don't see that here. He really turns the tables on us.
So we have a an owner who is a key part of the story. But Jesus is not really saying focus on the owner.
He's helping us understand that there are some things that the steward who's a bad steward in a lot of ways does that we should emulate in a surprising way because the steward recognizes that this manager recognizes that he has these resources, this influence for only a short period of time.
So we see that there's a leveraged position here and that the steward knows, the manager knows if he forgives some of these debts, the master doesn't really have much recourse to come after him. Because if the master does so, then the master is saying, well, I'm not really that generous. The master doesn't want to throw the steward and his family in jail because then he would be admitting that he wasn't generous to the people.
So the steward knows this and counts on this in his whole play. So it's it's a fascinating interpersonal dynamic here as well. But Jesus highlights what the steward actually does and how we should follow the way that the steward thinks about the resources that he has just for a short period of time.

Austin
And he it's really interesting to kind of continue that thought of, okay, well, the steward knows that he only has these for a short period of time. And he's thinking, okay, the master can't do anything right. The people that are in debt can't do anything. So how am I going to use what I have for both myself?
But also it elevates the view of the master because then the entire town around says, Oh, this master is really generous. And so it's really interesting to think about that. So as we think about as well, how do we emulate some of those things? Our time is limited the ways that we the time that we have to use our money and use our resources is limited.
And, you know, I think about, okay, who are the people that I have influence around me? How can I show the generosity of Christ towards me? How can I be that conduit? And I honestly don't want to be dishonorable. You know, there's aspects of this manager that we don't want to emulate. But there are aspects that we can emulate that that realizing that our time is limited, our time is short.

Spencer
We think about our neighbors. I mean, we may not live in the same home forever. We may not live in the same neighborhood forever. You know, we have a set period of time that we have to love on them, to influence them, to encourage them towards the Lord. We have obviously within our own household, you know, if we have kids that are growing up, we have a set amount of time, you know, where they're under our roof in all likelihood.
So you think about that even in the positions that we have of influence. We also think about that with our investments or our bank accounts, because there is nothing that we can do beyond the grave to have an influence on people around us that's substantial. You know, our my thought process is that even if we save resources and put them into a trust or an endowment or something like that, it's very, very difficult to speak beyond the grave with any level of significance to have that influence.
So we've got really a set period of time that we want to bring more and more. What can I do? You know, this day, this month, this year, this next season of life, to use those resources in a way that honors God, that blesses the people around us?

Austin
Well, I think it comes back to what we talked about several times before. It's asking those hard questions of how much is enough? And knowing where those finish lines are, because if we don't know how much is enough, then either control or fear can cause us to say, Oh, I need to build a bigger barn. Because I don't know how much I'll need in the future.
And so if we come back to this posture of trust, then it also shows, okay, I don't have to work 80 hours a week to provide. If I trust that God is my provider, then I don't have to overwork in order to build a bigger barn. And then that gives me more time with my kids if I know.
Okay, this is how much is enough for this season? I kind of started thinking, how much is enough for my kids for their lifetime that's not going to overburden them and pass on wealth that’s going to rot their soul. It's like, I don't want to rot my soul with wealth. I don't want my kids souls to rot with wealth.
And so I think the more that we are open handed and trusting and reminded that God is our provider and he is good at both shows our kids that we trust Jesus more than our wealth. We trust Jesus more than our money, and we don't look to just have all the money in the world, And I think those kind of things while yes, maybe we want to pass on resources to the next generation, that question of how much enough is enough keeps coming back because we want to pass on wisdom.
We don't just want to pass on money. I think about how does that enhance relationship. Well, we can pass on money to our kids. I've been incredibly blessed by parents and grandparents that have generously given to me, and I've seen how it has enhanced my lifestyle being able to go to college, being able to buy homes based on gifts from in-laws and based on gifts from family like it's just been a tremendous blessing.
But I'm grateful that it wasn't all, hey, here's a whole bunch of money when you're 18. I would not have known what to do with it as an 18 year old. So I think there's there needs to be that wisdom. And how are we using our time and money to enhance relationships?

Spencer
It comes back to really thinking about the future, laying it before the Lord and seeing him as our provider. So you highlighted not thinking about how much is enough for us now, So kind of on a year to year basis, also thinking and projecting that into the future, How much is enough for the future? I don't want to oversave.
We don't want to just build bigger barns and as we have that level of openness that also gives us a level of capacity, I should say, to listen to the Lord for what we may even do vocationally, because we might need to slow down so that we can actually engage with the people around us in a little different posture.
We might need to look at a different direction entirely in the way that we're focused on some of those extracurricular activities perhaps. So there's all kinds of different things when we answer that question of how much is enough in this season, you know, in the next few years, how much is enough for our lifetimes? How much is enough?
Do I really even think about for the people around me right now, for some of us and as we have clarity on that, we can we can have greater openness again with our hands, I think, and come back to that idea that this currency is going to be passing away. It's Confederate currency. It's going to do nothing for us when we're in heaven, literally nothing.
So we have it for a season. If we really can embrace that, there's a level of freedom, I think that comes with that and a level of joy in giving, because the more that we have, the more we have to think about things like, okay, am I making the right investments? How do I think about taxes on this?
Am I going to be overburdening people with this? Am I actually making a good gift here? Should I change my beneficiaries? You know, down the road we have less to give at the end of our lifetime because we've given it during our lifetimes. That's less of a decision. So all of those things help bring us back to this point of recognizing I've got an opportunity to have an influence for God's kingdom in this time, to love others, to bless others, to share about Jesus.
And if I do that well, each moment, then I actually have less fear. We come back to that fear and control those outcomes that we talked about, that if we can have open hands and trust God as our provider, then our experience along the way is also going to be better. We're going to be blessed in that because we're going to sense for presence each moment.

Austin
There's a beauty of bringing gifts forward. You know, rather than saying, okay, I want to leave X amount at the end of my lifetime. If I bring it forward, then I can say, Hey, I want to give you this gift. Now and I want to see maybe it's internally, I'm saying I want to see what you're going to do with it, whether it's to a charity, whether it's to a child.
I think about then it allows me to have that conversation in my lifetime. You said before, we can't speak through the grave. Once they're gone, there's no more communicating that we're going to do. And so when we accelerate those gifts, we bring them into our lifetime and say, okay, I'm going to give to this charity. Well, maybe they didn't use it the way that I wanted it, but maybe that allows me to say, hey, let's talk about the next time I give and let's let's see how this can actually be used more effectively.
Or maybe it's just that wasn't the right charity to give to you. Maybe seeing how the resources are allocated causes us to then rethink it should enhance the relationship. It should. I mean, that's the desire here is that when we pass on money, when we spend more time, when we volunteer with these charitable institutions, when we spend time with our kids, it's making the relationship deeper.
It's not pulling us away. And I think if we are pulled away from our family because of work constraints or we're concerned about money and we're pulled away, it doesn't allow us to invest that time, to grow the relationship, to build the wisdom. Similarly, if we care about certain charities or our churches, then that time that we invest allows us to see, Oh yeah, I want to give, I want to invest, I want to be moving those resources out, being a conduit God has provided for me so I can then press and pass those resources along.
But it's always in a manner that I want to live more deeply now, because when I'm dead, I'm not going to care right now. So as we close out today, we're maybe just some thoughts or examples that we've had of just life and how we've experienced those gifts from others.

Spencer
Well, I think one of the heroes of the faith that we could look back to is John Woolman was a Quaker, a tailor, and he basically arranged his entire life around the idea that he wanted to walk with the Lord in the midst of each moment. And that gave him the capacity to really sense the Lord, calling him to push for the end of slavery in his community.
So he arranged his life saying, okay, I'm not going to build bigger barns. I have enough. I know God is my provider and I also can listen to him now enough to say this is an evil, we need to address this. So I think there's plenty of heroes of the faith that we could go back to that that really lived this out and were very present to the influence that they had in that moment, both with the relationships and with the resources that they had, but kind of repositioning again, their work based on how much is enough and based on walking with the Lord to be faithful.

Austin
I think the reality too, is we're going to come up with against this this cultural milieu that says this is the water you swim in, just give away as much money as you can at the end of life. That's not what we want to be about. And we just have to realize that there is that significant rub going against that and spending down our resources while we have them is not normal.
It's not normal in the West and it's not a normal, especially in the United States. And so as we do this, we're going to come up against people saying, you're crazy, why are you doing this? And I think we just have to be open handed and say, because God has called us to. Because God has called us not to build bigger barns.
God has called us to use what we have now to guide people towards a deeper and more significant relationship with him.