Ep #07: Faithful stewardship means asking "How much is enough?"

Episode Transcript

Spencer
Welcome back to the second half stewardship. Glad that you're again joining us for this journey as we reflect on the fact that God owns it all. And as we dive in today, if we think back to last week, we were unpacking that Live, Give, Owe, Grow framework. If we think about God owning our money and us being stewards, it's a helpful framework to say it's going one of four of these, one of these four places. It's either going towards using it for living expenses, giving away resources, paying down debt, paying the government taxes, or towards growing with saving for future goals.
So before we go any further, Dad, joke of the day, Austin, why don't cows have any money?

Austin
We can't. We're. I don't know.

Spencer
Because the farmers milk them dry.

Austin
Oh, that's good.

Spencer
So, as we dive in again, we. We talk through some of those elements. You want to refresh us on these other pieces that we got into last week?

Austin
So, we kind of started unpacking this idea of what does it mean to hold resources rather than give them? What does it mean to participate with God? We get to enjoy this life with God. And we looked at the life of Solomon or we looked at the arguably like Solomon in Ecclesiastes is who had everything and he pursued the life that he dreamt of, the good life.
And it still led him to ruin it still led him to fall away, like just despair. Yeah. And so this week, we're going to look a little bit deeper into this idea of how much is enough, and it kind of it's going to really focus on the live side of the Live, Give, Owe, Grow framework because in order for us to really understand how do we live this life as faithful stewards, we really have to wrestle with and grapple with that question of how much is enough for me?
How much is enough for the next generation and how much is enough for the community? What does my community need? So really asking those hard, pressing questions about how much is enough is really going to start driving the needle. And from that we get to be generous. Like if we can set lifestyle caps of our consumption of what we spend money on ourselves, it really frees us in a lot of ways to then give abundantly to be generous stewards.
But first we have to start with open hands and say, God, this is yours. All of it is yours. Just like we've said over and over. My money, my time, my relationships, my experiences, all of it is God's. My entire existence is God's. He is the manager and I get to utilize all these resources for the Kingdom right.

Spencer
Well, and that's so difficult because our culture has a different message, which is Live your best life now. There's nothing you should do to restrain yourself. In fact, think about those things that bring you the most joy and then try to do them as much as you can. You know one commentator in our culture would say, dial up that level of spending on yourself for the things that you love, which is not what the gospel says.
So as we think about that, part of the difficulty, though, is there's nothing in Scripture that says this is how you determine what is enough. You know, there are a general guidelines and scripture does speak, but it is not something that lines out what your budget exactly is.

Austin
Yeah, it would be really easy if Jesus had said for you, single people, here's your number. If you're married, multiply it by this. If you're married with children, multiply it by this fact. But he never does. Right. And it it changes based on your time and your geography and your season of life. So that idea of how much is enough, it's a moving target.
But I think that there is real freedom in setting those limits. And pursuing the Lord with those limits. And I think the other thing that's really challenging about this, it's not in scripture of like the number. But it's also antithetical to everything we see and hear. I don't feel like there have been many, if any, sermons that I've even heard about setting limits on lifestyle and consumption.
So even I think, you know, we go back a couple of episodes ago to that, the quote from the Freakonomics podcast about an individualist culture we produce churches that look like Wal-Mart selling us to the desired state that we want. So even if our churches are showing us that, hey, look to this lifestyle, even if they're not saying it explicitly, maybe some of the undergirding ways that we are presenting ourselves as the church are not antithetical to that culture where we need it to be.
So I feel like my lifestyle creep needs to be checked in church, it needs to be checked by my community. And I have to confess that it's not often done in that regard.

Spencer
Well, as we talked about last time, contentment is much more difficult to pursue than consumption, because we see ads were inundated with them all day. The number of imprints that we have of somebody trying to sell us something is astronomical compared to even where it was 30 and 40 years ago. Yeah. So it is something that we have to move with intention against the flow of our culture if we're going to align ourselves with the gospel.
So as we look at today, the passage that we're getting into 1 Timothy 6:6-10. Austin You want to unpack some context for us here?

Austin
So, Paul, in this letter, he's writing something and Timothy is someone he affectionately calls his child in the faith. So, they have an intimate relationship. And Paul, in this letter, he's wanting to combat false teaching and convey to Timothy what spiritual leadership ought to look like. And especially in the back of these the this letter he's really starting to press in this is what spiritual leadership is seek these things.
And the verses immediately preceding these verses that we're going to read warn Timothy to teach sound doctrine. He warns of people who are not aligned with the godliness, whose teaching is not aligned with the godliness in Christ. And he says that produces quarreling, controversy, envy, produces dissension and slander. And then the false teachers of the day. They're hoping that their version of godliness will bring about monetary gain.
And so there's not only this he realized that Paul's realizing that if you teach something antithetical to Christ, it's going to produce division. But he's also saying there's people out there that want to show off their godliness so that they can make money. So there's a twofold setup that Paul is laying here. So, Spencer, you want to read those verses for us?

Spencer
So again, 1 Timothy 6:6-10, “But godliness with contentment is great gain, for we brought nothing into the world and we cannot take anything out of the world. But if we have food and clothing with these, we will be content. But those who desire to be rich fall into temptation, into a snare, into many senseless and harmful desires that plunge people into ruin and destruction. For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evils. It is through this craving that some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pangs.

Austin
I feel like I've heard some of those words recently. You know, last week we unpacked Hebrews 13:5-6, and it talked about the love of money that leads us astray. Yeah. Christ has said you cannot worship both. God and money. That seems to be repeated right pretty frequently. Right. What are some thoughts that you have on aspects?

Spencer
Well, I think it's easy for us who have maybe been in the church to say, well, I don't love money. But the reality is, I think if Paul was writing to us, he would be saying the same thing and he might make it more pointed, because when we use money as a way to protect ourselves, maybe from difficulties, when we use money and we we prioritize it to defend us against the harms of this world, when we use it in such a way that it fulfills us, we might not say, I have an affection that I feel for money. We might not admit to that or confess that, but our lives say otherwise. And so I think we really we have to take a beat here and say, in what ways am I depending on money? In what ways is my happiness very deeply linked to money and having money and not just now, but in the future? Because I think that's what Paul's really getting at. It's that dependance on money, it's that desire for it. It's that security that it brings rather than the contentment that God is our provider.

Austin
And, you know, I think the other piece that I often hear is, oh, I don't love money, but that the flip of it is I've heard sermons. It'll say the love of money is the root of all evil. Oh, you know, and you just explode it and say, stay away from money, flee away from it. But God uses money all the time.
And what Paul is really again, coming back to what you're saying, saying it's kind of like verse six in the New American Standard says Godliness actually actually is a means of great gain when accompanied by contentment. We experience great spiritual gain, you know, like we were talking about earlier, Paul is setting up that. There are people that are greedy and they're trying to gain money through their godliness.
But here he's saying no godliness through contentment, not through physical gain. Leads to great gain that godliness produces in us this great spiritual gain through contentment. And it's not to. And then go away from the love of money which leads to destruction, which leads to all kinds of evil.

Spencer
Because when we get that situated in a different way and we put any of our hope, any of our security in money, it's misplaced. And that is just par for the course we're seeing in American culture. Sad enough as it is.

Austin
The more numbers in my bank account makes me feel a whole lot more comfortable and like, I can do the things that I want to do, which, again, it makes me look inside myself and it doesn't make me look outward and see where is God leading. If I can continue to increase that bank account. Yeah, it makes me feel more secure.
But I think what we are continuing to see in Scripture, it's not about me feeling secure, it's about what am I doing? Like am I holding on to these things and what are they doing to my soul?

Spencer
Because as you mentioned earlier, money can be a conduit of God's grace to other people. He can use that. But when we store it, it is not morally neutral. It is at a minimum a burden to us. It can be a burden that he asks us to carry for a season. But we really need to grapple with how long does that season need to be and how do we put constraints on that so that we don't carry more than we need to?

Austin
And going back into the passage, there's nothing in this world that we have that will physically take us, take with us and do eternity. You know, so I think that there's this question, why do we chase, covet and pursue stuff for pleasure? There was a speaker at a event that we went to recently that or maybe one of the other participants that said they just called stuff future trash and I just thought that was such a great way to posit it, because it's everything.
As I look around this room, everything in here is future trash. Whether for ourselves or for somebody else, whether we give it away to somebody somewhere or something. It's all future trash. We can't take any of this with us. So why am I trying to hold on to it like it's mine? And I need a death grip on it.

Spencer
And we see this not just in the New Testament, not just in Jesus teaching. We see this in the Old Testament as well. So we go back to Deuteronomy 8:16-18 to get a view into how this played out, even in the wilderness. So the text here says, again, speaking of God, "Who fed you in the wilderness with manna that your father did not know, that he might humble you and test you to do you good? In the end, beware, lest you say in your heart, my power and the might of my hand have gotten me this wealth. You shall remember the Lord your God, for it is He who gives you power to get wealth, that he may confirm his covenant that he swore to your fathers as it is this day." So we come here to a passage that Moses is speaking to the people, and he's telling them that they're going to be tempted when things go well.
For them to say, this was by our might, this was by our power, this was, you know, this wealth that we've accumulated is because of our acumen, our deeds. And he's saying, you're going to be tempted with that, but you need to remember that it's God who gives that to you. And so that's even you know, we look back to the Old Testament and very much a part of what Moses knew would be the temptation if things went well.

Austin
It was so striking to me as I was reading this passage earlier, the entirety of it coming back to verse 11, it's take care. Lest you forget the Lord, your God. Like there are just these commands. And I think about in a lot of ways the whole of Deuteronomy. Yeah, it comes back over and over and over.
Remember the Lord remember the Lord remembers the Lord, don't forget the Lord, right? And it's in these passages, it's saying, God has just brought you out. Don't get to a place where you build your your own homes and forget the wandering in the wilderness. Don't forget where you were slaves in Egypt, where I brought you out or I redeemed you.
Because if that happens, beware, lest you say in your heart, as verse 17 says My power and might the might of my hand have gotten me this wealth. God is saying, No, no, no. When you left Egypt and I gave you all the riches of Egypt. That was not you. You were slaves. Hey, I am the one that took you out, but it just shows it's such this lens into our hearts that we can be so content with the Lord when times are hard and times are difficult and we have to trust him.
I think about my ten years on staff with campus ministry. There were so many times where I was looking at our staff account and thinking, God, are you going to provide like our paychecks? Come in in a couple of weeks? And I don't know if there's going to be funds in there.
And every single time he did, as we sought the Lord, he provided but as as our bank, as our staff account increased and in value at times, it was really easy to sit back and be like, okay, I feel comfortable. Sure. And so he's very clear in these moments that like, no, don't forget that I am the one that provides for you.
Don't ever forget it any moment and don't start to think that this is yours, that you've done and gotten like I am the one that did this for you.

Spencer
It seems like even there's a parallel to what we see in American culture and in the West in general. You know, as we have prospered materially, we seem to forget more and more about God. Yeah, we we just don't have a concept of a creator, one who is engaging with us. It seems that we look at things and say, okay, it's by the might and by the intelligence of our own hands and by our acumen that we're able to do all these things and feed all these people.
And, you know, rather than saying, no, this is an amazing gift that we've been given these things even in our country.

Austin
When I look at like the last verses of the the passage and Timothy and then the last verse is say it is through this craving that some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pangs. And then in the end of Deuteronomy versus 19 and 20, God says, And if you forget the Lord your God, and go after other Gods and serve them and worship them, I solemnly warn you today that you shall surely perish.
Yeah. Like it's it's not just God is calling us to remember, it's that he says, Hey, this is what is going to happen to you, right? It's it's not a surprise to him because he knows that as we wander away, as we start to trust in ourselves, as we start to say, look at what we can do.
It moves us away from trusting or it moves us away from saying, God, I need you and I'm I'm yours. I'm your servant.

Spencer
Well, and it's it's something that we in a in a nation that has prospered materially. It's something that we really have to confront. You alluded to the fact that we could go off and live in the hills and just detach ourselves. We're not doing that, obviously, but if we are engaged in our culture and we experience some level of prosperity, you know, all of the innovations and the different things that we have that, you know, 200 years ago were not available to any human being.
We just think about some of the advancements. It's amazing. And yet it can separate us from God. Yeah. And the more that we allow those things that are in this world to become things that we crave or we love, things that we're attached to.
We have to recognize they're not morally neutral. You know, if we have a bigger home, if we have, you know, more toys, more possessions, I think on the balance, we have to say, good grief, this is these things have that capacity to pull me away from the Lord. They will pull me away from the Lord. We have to be sober about that.
And that's I think again where we need that community coming back and saying, okay, is that a need? You know what, let's talk about how we encourage one another to be open handed right there.

Austin
So we've kind of come around several places and looked at this idea of contentment. And don't forget, the Lord, how do we actually put this into play? I think that's the big question that I come back to, is wrestling with the question of how much is enough. The scripture doesn't say you need $70,000, right? This is your line, don't cross it. You know, how do we get there? How do we get to figuring out what's enough?

Spencer
Right. Well, to me, one of the things that we've got to do more of is just allowing the Lord to speak into it. If we distract ourselves to the point where we have no idea really what we're spending.
If we distract ourselves to the point where we fill up our lives so much that we don't even really take stock, then there can be no change. We know we could be right on the path that the Lord has us. We probably are. There's probably things that He would speak into our lives. We have no knowledge, right, because we can't listen.
And so part of it, I think, is getting to a place where we've got enough space not to get our budget down to the dime, but at least to be able to track things and to lay things before the Lord. Because these are our decisions. Yeah. If we take no time for it and we fill our lives with so much stuff that we're going all week at work and then we're going on the weekends, you know, to pursue pleasures and we, you know, maybe we get to the end of Sunday night and we've got, you know, 3 minutes and we check, you know, the credit card and bank just to make sure there was no fraud in the last month. You know, that's that's not really acting as a steward when we think about our role as a steward. A steward comes before the master and presents what he's done. Yeah, what she's done. And I think if we look at it from that posture and say, okay, at least I need to have a sense of what's going on here and there needs to be an approach to this, not that we're saying it has to be, you know, X amount, this percentage, what have you.
But just taking stock, I think is a first step and then laying it before the Lord and asking him to speak. If we get there then we, we've got a chance to listen. Yeah. You know if we have a consistent method of doing those things.

Austin
Well I think even as you were saying that I've wrestled a lot I think in the last five years or so with, with this idea of what is a biblical community. Yeah. And there's, there's kind of the common you're not allowed to talk about certain things in American culture. You can't talk about politics, you can't talk about religion and you can't talk about money.
Well, we've got two right now. But, you know, if you say we're not allowed to talk about money, then you're not allowed to talk about religion. Well, what can your community, your faith, speak into your spending habits? If we're already saying this is a taboo subject, right, then I'm not allowing you to say, Hey, Austin, I don't know if that's such a wise decision with your money.
And I think maybe there's a space for us to be radical in that. Like, maybe I don't just look at my spending with my wife, right? But maybe I say, Hey, Spencer, will you and Emily, will you look at this with us and say, let's invite each other into it? Yeah. We were never designed by the Father to be individuals living in isolation.
We were always meant to be a part of a community. Then I think we'll wrestle with this a lot in future episodes. But what does it look like to be for the good of the community? What does it look like to pursue justice for the poor? It's a big part of the heart of God is justice for the poor.
But if I don't know that there are poor because I'm not willing to talk to my neighbors and my family of faith about, hey, where are you doing? How are you? How are you doing with money? If I don't know that my neighbor is struggling, how can I give to serve them right? So I think that there's you know, I need to get before the Lord.
And maybe I need to invite a trusted brother to speak into my finances with me.

Spencer
I think having the humility first to just be able to have everything in one place, then to lay it before the Lord and then also to have a brother or sister be able to look and say to invite that person. You know, I think it comes back to so much. We're not trying to push this on someone, but there's an opportunity that we have to invite someone in.
I think that's a different posture. If we do that, then they can see our blind spots. Yeah, because we as we read the Bible, we're going to read it from a particular angle, a particular lens that has some strengths but also has some blind spots. Yeah. And coming from American culture, you know, we have big blind spots about how we use money.
You know, I think it was there's a number of different pastors that have said this, but I think Tim Keller said that, you know, he had never had anybody come and confess greed, you know, to him, I can't there's someone else that had said the same thing. You know, in all their decades of serving and hearing confession, never heard that.
And so it is one of those blind spots, I think, in our culture that's so easy. And some of it I think we need to be able to bounce things off because, you know, when our fourth child showed up, there were some changes, you know, that happened legitimately, that there were extra medical expenses and there were, you know, extra things that we really needed to be able to support the family in that some of them were unexpected, but there needs to be grace, you know, in avenues that we kind of figure out things together and really an encouragement, I think, in the midst of those difficult seasons to to be a support, you know, in there as well.
As we look forward, I think we've kind of talked about some of these ideas of what what are some next steps, but right. Well, we'll come back to you and say try to work through memorizing James 1:5, “If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask God who gives generously to all without reproach, and it will be given to him.”
Seek wisdom in this. And I'll say, I threw out the idea of sharing your budget with someone that scares me. The idea of inviting Spencer into that. Yeah. Even as a dear friend, it's. It scares me. So seek the Lord. Pray for wisdom, right? And and learn how to ask hard questions of yourself in community. And some of the things you can do are, again, how much is enough?
That's a great question to ask. But then like we've been talking about review spending patterns, I think the challenge for me as I've exited full time ministry, I've moved into a job that gives grants me more income. That the challenge that I find is that I've moved from a place where I don't have to say no.
And I think that's a harder place to be. I have to choose to say no. Yeah. When we were in ministry, it was very easy if our family said, Hey, we're taking a vacation to X spot, we'll pay once you get here, but you have to get here. And I look at my family of five and I say, Well, that flight is $1,000 or that flight is $500 and times that by five.
That's 2500 or 5000. There's no way on a salary significantly less than than what I'm making now that I could have justified it. Whereas now it's like, well, we can afford it, but should I? And it's that we've entered a season where it's much more difficult to choose to say no than it is to have to say no. And so I think spending patterns are really challenging because it reminds me I have to lay things before the Lord.

Spencer
I think even more than most of us recognize as Americans were all there. Yeah, you know, because we have so many different things that we can spend on at some level, we all have that capacity to say, is this really what the Lord's up to? Yeah.

Austin
Yeah. So two thoughts to close this out again. We'd love if you find value in this, share with a friend and talk about it with a friend. Yeah. Don't just share it and say good luck. Yeah. But maybe talk about it with them. Wrestle some through these things with them. Yeah. And some upcoming. In our next episode, we'll be talking a little bit more deeply into this idea that stewardship takes sacrifice, which requires that we reflect on Christ and His call upon our lives.

Austin
So I'm going to finish this out with this quote from Andrew Murray, “How different our standard is from Christ. We ask how much a man gives. Christ asks how much a man keeps.” Again, “how different our standard is from Christ. We ask how much a man gives, Christ asks how much a man keeps.”
And that's the stewardship question, you know, how much do I keep? Lord Yeah. So, well, thanks again for journeying with us. If you have questions or comments, please leave those with us or reach out. We'd love to hear from you.