Ep #09: Giving Breaks the Power of Money

Episode Transcript

Spencer
Welcome back to the Second Half Stewardship. We're really excited to have you again with us. And today we get into a bit of a dicey conversation. And it's about money. It is about how money is an idol. About how it can have power over us. Jesus explicitly calls out to us in teaching that money rather than sex or rather than power, or rather than any other kind of temptation has a power over us that is maybe different than the others.
And so we're going to dive into that today. And how giving actually can break the power of money over us. So, we're going to get into a few more statistics today than we normally would. So. Austin, can you kick us off as we get into that?

Austin
Yeah, I would love to. I'm going to start off by reading a quote from the book, who we've quoted several times. It's from John Mark Comer's “The Ruthless Elimination of Hurry.” And he says the French sociologist John Baudrillard has made the point that in the Western world, “Materialism has become the new dominant system of meaning. He argues atheism hasn't replaced cultural Christianity, shopping has.”
And so as we think about the difference of where the Western world sets, we think about shopping. Materialism consumes so much of who we are. And we talked about that several times on the last podcast, how after 911, President Bush said, go shopping. Return to normal, like great materialism and consumption is very normalized. But, you know, as we think about how that actually affects us and if we look back 90 to 100 years ago.
What are the differences of how we lived in the Great Depression era versus how we live today? So in the Great Depression, we looked at some census statistics, there were about 3.4 people per household. Whereas today we've got about one less and about 2.5 people per household. You also had this is something I found really interesting in that census data.
9.8% of households had an unrelated person living with them in that household. So typically, it was there was a little bit more of a communal living in homes where about 1200 square feet smaller.

Spencer
Oh, wow. So about half the size, huh?

Austin
Yeah, about half the size. So 2,300 square feet today. 1,100 square feet back then. So that means you had almost three times less square foot per person in the 1930s than today. So our size of our homes is increased. The size of our families has decreased. But I think one of the most telling things was I found some statistics on giving.
And it said that in the Great Depression, people typically gave 3.5% of their income. Whereas today in this one data source, it said Christians give 2.5%. So in the middle of the great Depression, people were giving more generously. And you can argue whether 3.5% is generous, but in the midst of one of the hardest economic times that our country's ever seen, we are giving less today. We have greater wealth today, but we give less than we did in a time of incredible economic distress. So, there's just there's a lot of factors in here that we look at and we say our spending, we spend significantly more on housing, on transportation, on just other things in general. Whereas in 1917 to 1919, we spent most of our money on food. You think about like daily sustenance. Food and housing took up about 67% of consumption back then. Right. Whereas food and housing today is only about 45-46%.

Spencer
And then that third variable, their clothing was about 17% back then. So just having a few garments to be able to wear versus what we have now. And we only spend about 3% on clothing. So, to your point, I mean, the amount that we spend on entertainment and getting different places so that we can be entertained and do our activities is kind of through the roof.

Austin
As I as I thought about this, I wrote this down. This isn’t a quote from anybody. It's a quote from Spencer and I. I think he put on a little bit more. We wrote, “Unchecked prosperity has led to distraction from God, covetousness and greed. This produced a generation of Christians who give less generously and spend most of their income on themselves. We are much like Adam and Eve when they sinned we could say that they disobeyed God. But what really happened is they simply wanted something more than they wanted God.” And I think, you know, as I look at myself, I, I like spending on myself. I like giving, but it's much easier to go buy something for me than it is to choose to give to a charitable cause. So I don't know if it's similar with you, but I just feel like this unchecked prosperity. The wealth that I have either been given or have saved for. The more that I have, the more that it turns my heart from the Lord. The more that it turns my heart to greed and to covet what my neighbor has.

Spencer
I think it's in sneaky ways, because we look at the people around us and we think, well, I'm not spending as much as, you know, Tom across the street or Susan, you know, down the road. I don't have the same car that they have or my home isn't as big. I don't go out to eat as much.
But when we look at that, where we actually spend relative to the rest of the world or where we were as a society 100 years ago.We do see that that that stream has shifted very, very substantially.
And we've got to recognize that to do something different, to break the power that money has not just on us, but really culturally kind of the stranglehold that it has on our culture. You referencing President Bush, you know, in 2001, wanting us to get back out and spend. You know, that's like the core value, sadly.
Rather than than really going in a different direction and saying, you know, let's take time to really reflect and to mourn and life needs to get back to normal at some point, but spending isn't the, the first thing that we need to think about.

Austin
So, you know, as we think about what does the Bible say? How do we enter this place? We’re going to read 2 Corinthians to start off in a little bit and we'll get there. But just thinking back to some prior episodes, you know, we looked at 1 Timothy 6 and Paul says godliness with contentment is great gain.
And, you know, we want to always come back as well to Ephesians 2:4-7, that “God being rich and mercy because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead and trespasses and sins, he made us alive together with Christ.” When we enter these dicey places where we talk about our own covetousness, where we talk about the greed of society, a couple of episodes ago we talked about we were thinking about individualism, that Harvard professor that said American churches are all about competition.
They're about who's the biggest, it has produced a Wal-Mart type competitiveness. So we enter these dicey places, but we want to always be remembering that “But God” in his great love with which he loved us. It is always a reminder: it is godliness with contentment that leads to great gain.
And a couple chapters before the passage it will read in 2 Corinthians. Paul is reminding the Corinthians that as they trusted God, it led to spiritual growth, it led to them being transformed. And he says godly grief leads to that transformation. It's not a worldly grief that leads to repentance and transformation. It's godly grief. It's recognizing that the sin of covetousness, the sin of greed, will destroy us.
But we can't let that in a worldly way make us just sink down into grief. We need to allow godly grief to then transform us, to trust the Lord.

Spencer
Well, and we also want to think about this not coming from a place of shaming. Because it's really an invitation to know God more deeply. To have a richer relationship with him, to have less dependency. When we think about this as an idol and when we think about this as having a hold over our heart, it's an addiction in some ways. And addictions are not good things. We can all agree whether it's to a substance or, you know, to a line of action that is harmful.
It's not a good thing. So if we can shift our mindset some to have the eyes of our hearts opened to what this really is and to have that grief as you talk about, and then to see God's great love in the midst of it. Then we put ourselves in a position where it's an invitation. And there's a desire to do that rather than feeling like, okay, I'm getting knocked over the head and I just need to pull out my checkbook and write a couple more checks to charitable institutions.
That's not the goal here. It's to arrive at a place where actually we're walking more intimately with the Lord consistently. And we've even got more space to do that. Maybe because we've let go some of those things that are activities that they have a hold of our heart. They cost money, but they're really just a distraction from the Lord.

Austin
Absolutely. So let's go ahead and dive in to our passage for today. So we've kind of talked a little bit about the context of it. We're going to read 2 Corinthians 9:6-11. What I found really interesting about this is a lot of the letter of 1 Corinthians Paul is really calling out the church in Corinth for some really grievous sin patterns.
And in some of the books that we have read recently, a lot of those led or came about because of the wealth of the Corinthian church, and that wealth led them to be distracted from the Lord. And in 1 Corinthians, Paul is very strong, calling the church out in Corinth for those sin patterns. And then in 2 Corinthians, he in some way starts to turn that conversation because they've started to repent and they've started to follow the Lord and they've started returning back to their first love. 9:6-11 is talking about, now that you've kind of started seeing this, what do we do now, right, in terms of this giving?

Spencer
So why don’t I read it and you can dive in. Paul says “The point is this: whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. Each one must give as he has decided in his heart, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver. And God is able to make all grace abound to you, so that having all sufficiency in all things at all times, you may abound in every good work. As it is written, ‘He has distributed freely, he has given to the poor; his righteousness endures forever.’ He who supplies seed to the sower and bread for food will supply and multiply your seed for sowing and increase the harvest of your righteousness. You will be enriched in every way to be generous in every way, which through us will produce thanksgiving to God.”

Austin
And I think just it's just such a beautiful reminder that as we start laying down before the Lord, everything that we have. And because we've said it over and over, God owns it all. He owns everything. We are merely stewards of everything that God has given us. So he has bound to fully bless the church in Corinth. We saw that in 1 Corinthians. And now he's saying, okay, let us give. Not under compulsion. But as God directs us and God loves a cheerful giver. Not a compulsive giver.
He loves a cheerful giver. God is able to make all grace abound to you. His grace is always going to be there. It's what I think that that longing of God is that we trust him. The longing of God is we say this is yours. And I'm simply giving it to you to steward.
And so it's a matter of how am I going to respond to that? Am I going to respond to that in joyful giving and cheerful giving? Or in compulsion to give? And I think that's oftentimes what I've felt as a Christian is like, oh, I have to give X amount. Whether it's 10% or more, it's felt like, okay, I have to give this.
And the times that I have been obedient to that God has been very faithful. But it's also more enjoyable to give when I'm delighted in giving. Versus just like, oh, I've got to write a check. I have to write a check. I'm not doing enough if I'm doing it out of worldly grief. And not out of a godly grief.
Of not listening to you and following Christ then it changes everything about my giving in my heart towards get it right.

Spencer
It is that vision of sowing. And how we think about what we want to reap. You know, there's so many different quotes here. One that comes to mind. We go back to Jim Elliott, “He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose.” The sense is let's sow in a way that we want to reap tremendous reward. And that can be relationship, obviously, with the Father, but it can also be in looking at the Lord's work through those dollars that are invested in the good work of feeding the poor, helping those who are in need, in building up the church. So many different pieces.

Austin
Well, and just a practical example. As I was wrestling with where we were giving. And started to seeing that God has such a heart for the poor. And I thought that we had a little bit of extra income we can give a little bit. But I don't know anybody that's practically working with the poor right now.
And part of me is, like, I just want to be wise about where you want us to give this money. And so I said, okay, God, if you're going to do something here, I want to honor where you are going to open this door and know that you're doing something in my life right now. And as we are praying about that, we have a friend who's on one of my son's soccer teams who's moving to a large country in Southeast Asia to work with victims of sex trafficking.
And they're in the middle of raising support. And it was just such a gift from the Lord, as I'm saying, God, I want to be open handed right with this that you've given. He just opens the door for me to then be able to partner with this friend in the work that he's doing, that is affecting the poor.
It's like and it just brought me so much delight on that day. And I texted that friend afterwards and I was like, this was the best birthday present I could have been given to be able to enter this with you, because it's a place where God loves the poor. As it's written, he has distributed freely, he has given to the poor. His righteousness endures forever. God cares about and loves the poor and wants to restore them. And he was just such a cheerful moment for me to be able to partner with his friend, to say, okay, where you are moving, Lord, I want to be there.

Spencer
Well, and from a practical standpoint, you know, where we put our money, where we sow is where we're going to reap. So, you know, in your example, certainly a wonderful opportunity to have an impact in being able to serve the poor and those who have been taken advantage of in some heartbreaking ways. I think in my life with Emily, as we think back on the relationships, one of the places that we know a lady who runs a school in Mozambique and serves orphans in that school. Has several hundred kids that are in that school and makes a tremendous impact there.
As we started to give financially there a number of years ago, I just noticed that my heart was much more engaged. And when we would pray in the evenings with our kids. And they had met Sybil, who runs the school, they were much more engaged as well. And so it led to this joy of being able to support her and being able to have that conversation and to be able to help those kiddos.
And at the same time, I see historically when I've had funds invested elsewhere, and it's not bad to invest in, in enterprises and such. I remember one time, about ten years ago, I was picking a few different stocks and one of them was H&R BLOCK. And so for about a year, while I held H&R BLOCK, I was very concerned about how H&R BLOCK was doing, about how their financials were doing, about how their board was.
And so my heart was much more engaged there. I had never been interested in H&R BLOCK before I made that investment, but for that roughly year that I had that investment I was very concerned about H&R BLOCK. And it just comes back to, you know, where we put our resources, where we sow we get very invested there. And practically speaking, if we're using our resources for our own desires, pleasures, you know, using them for, you know, nights out and here and there in a way that showcases that maybe that has a stranglehold on our heart.
That's where our treasure essentially is. You know, we think about the next time that we get to go to that restaurant or we get to have that experience or we get to go on that vacation. And it becomes much more of a focus. And those can be good things. Like, yeah, they're wonderful things to go out on a, you know, a dinner with friends or with a spouse or what have you. But it can also be if too much of our heart gets taken in that direction, that's where money has that power over us.

Austin
Well, you know, we talked about before, like Jesus didn't stray away from going to parties. He went. But it wasn't every night going to a different party. Or if it was, he was going to serve the people there. And so I think that there's there always is going to be this balance of times to celebrate. But I don't think life always needs to be a celebration. And I think I've seen that in in times of my life where, you know, when we lived in Colorado, it's like, hey, what are you doing this weekend?
Are you going climbing? Are you going hiking? Are you going paddling? Like, what's the next adventure? And when everybody is chasing something new, then life becomes about the next adventure. And that all takes money or you know, we're around when we're around friends that go out to eat all the time and are talking about great restaurants, then my heart is pulled to do the same thing.

Versus when I'm trying to live simply and realize like, okay, God, when are we given seasons to celebrate? When are we given seasons to enter this good, beautiful, joyful time that is celebrating. It is very different than living a life where I'm constantly chasing the next thing, the next celebration, which then leads my heart away. And it closes opportunities to give.

Spencer
Well, and even on a practical example, one of the coaching programs that I was in, one of the things that we were supposed to be doing is financial advisors for our own personal lives are saying, “what are all the trips that we want to take our family on?” Which there's some wonderful things and we do want to take our kids to some great places, national parks, to see a lot of different things.
But I noticed as I started to make this list that the task of doing so was pulling my heart more towards, you know, these experiences and using funds towards those experiences rather than really prioritizing the simple time with family, which is critical and the simplicity of being able to have time with the Lord and listen to him.
Because when our lives get filled up with so many different things and we're spending money in so many different ways to have these activities, one of the first things that can go by the wayside is that space to have time with the Lord to be able to listen just the simplicity of that rhythm.

Austin
So, as we started thinking about closing out this episode, Randy Alcorn says, “You can't take it with you, but you can send it on ahead.” And I think about in Matthew 6 where Jesus says, “Where your treasure is, there your heart is also” and “Do not lay out for yourselves treasures on earth where moth and rust destroy, where thieves break in and steal but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven where moth and rust can't destroy where thieves do not break in and steal.” And God wants us to be investing in his kingdom because it's going to last forever.
You can't take these things with you. There's nothing that I am going to take in this life that I will take with me into the next. But we can send it on ahead.

Spencer
We can. And as we do that, we have a level of joy, I think oftentimes, but also a level of rest, because, you know, whether we are investing those resources for the future sometimes and doing more than we need or whether we are simply spending them sometimes that can be exhausting. You know, when we take the trip and we, you know, take one trip after another and we've got to get all of the plane tickets together and all of the different activities together. It can be a wonderful gift and we do try to do that from time to time as our family. But if we tried to do any more than we are, be exhausting. If we were trying to keep up with some of the folks that we see around us, it would just be exhausting for me. So, all of us have a different balance there, but as we send it on ahead, we release the money from our hands and it breaks that power that that money has because it's not ours anymore. It never was. God owns it all and we come back to that. But that's a practical way that we can break the power of money over our lives.

Austin
Yeah. We'll get into saving later. We'll get into some of those other uses of money This is the one that breaks all of its power. When we think about owning debt, we think about owning taxes. When we think about saving, we think about living expenses. None of those break the power that money has.
But when I give it away, I don't have it anymore. When I give it back to God because it was his in the first place and it is his, then it breaks the power of me saying, I need to grab, I need, I need, I need. And it's just it's such a sweet reminder that God allows us to enter that place of rest with him and place of trust in him that I get to give money away.
And He is going to use it. And, like, he talks about it in that Corinthians passage, like He is going to allow us to reap bountifully. It may not be of earthly things. It may be seeing people in the kingdom that we would have never seen here on Earth. But we're impacted because of some of the gifts we made. It's just I would much rather spend my money there than choose to go out to dinner four nights a week this week.

Spencer
Sure. Well, good. Well, we will dive further into these concepts over the next few weeks. And again, delighted to have you join us this time. Take care.