Ep. 035 - How do you talk with kids about money?

Episode Transcript

Spencer
We fear not having enough. And whether it's frugal multimillionaires that we sit down with, who sheepishly confess that they still don't feel like they quite have enough. Or people that we encounter in the neighborhood who are just living meal to meal. It's this sense that we don't have perfect control of all of the different outcomes, and we know that we're vulnerable because of the fall. That harm can happen. And so today we want to explore what the Bible says about God's process for providing for us.

Austin
When we look at the Bible and specifically the first story, Adam and Eve, God sends them out of the garden. And as he is sending them out of the garden, he clothes them. And, you know, as I think about this story and I think about it in terms of God is provider, God still loved Adam and Eve, despite their fall, despite their rebellion against him, and in the midst of it, he still chooses to send them out slightly less vulnerable than before.
I think about if they were walking around naked in a harsh world, they would have to start thinking about what is the first thing that I need to do? Well, I need to find clothing, but God takes care of those very first things that Adam and Eve consider that they needed to always provide of their food. But now, as they're entering into a harsh world, God isn't abandoning them.
He has continued to provide for them, even through that rebellion, even through that broken relationship. And, you know, we see this time and time and time again through scripture that even though we walk away from God, we drift away from him. He still takes time and takes opportunities to move towards us, to provide for us and to give us the things that we need.
And a lot of the time it's surprising. It's in surprising ways that he does that. And so, yeah, like you mentioned earlier, we want to dive into this reality that we are part of God's bigger story, this story of our lives, where we often see ourselves as the main characters, is not true. We are not the main characters of the story.
We are supplemental characters to the story that God is telling. So how does this maybe differentiate from what culture says about the world around us?

Spencer
Well, of course, we've talked about the fall and we've talked about this sense of vulnerability and this exposure that we have. And one of the most common ways that people answer the question of how much is enough is if I just had 15% more. And you can ask a billionaire this. You can ask a person who's a multimillionaire this you can ask somebody who's living meal to meal and the consistent answer is, if I just had a little bit more, if I just had a little more buffer, I'd be in good shape.
But what that really exposes to us or shows us is that there's never enough. There's never enough to be able to protect us from the reality that this is a broken world. So we've got to really confront that. And if we do and if we recognize that, I think when we get to the other side, there's hope. But until we really grapple with what the culture is telling us, with what the trajectory of the world is, which is if I if I can kind of insulate myself just a little bit more, I can sleep at night.
That'll work for a season, and then we'll be reminded, Oh, that was just a facade.

Austin
Well, you know, I think about this Ron Blue is I asked at one point in time if he was asking people if you had to give up 10% of your income, would you be okay? In this idea of, well, if an emergency situation arose, could I cut 10% of my income? And people across the board were like, Yeah, of course, if an emergency were to arise, I could cut 10% of my spending.
He was saying this in light of the idea of the tithe and saying, Well, if you could cut 10% of your spending, then you can probably give 10% of it away. But I think you look at it in a contrary nature of our minds, perception is that I need 15% more. But if an emergency were to arise, I could cut 10% out.
And so there's a contrasting nature of even how our minds think about money and how we parse out our finances.

Spencer
One of the things that we really need to remind ourselves very often, I think, is that God doesn't say, provide for yourself anywhere. There's this cultural ethos, I think particularly in some parts of Christendom, that put the onus on parents to provide for the kids or particularly even dads to be the breadwinner. And that's just not in scripture.
Or again, we've talked about this, but we're to be caretakers were to be shepherds were to be encouraged. And leaders, never providers for the family. Only God can do that. And that puts us in a different relationship with God because we're always looking to him and we do. We can actually take our family before the Lord if we have a family, take them before the Lord to see that our posture is together, that we're looking to him.
They're not looking to us. We're not carrying the weight of the world.

Austin
And so as we think about that, I love that idea of we're in it together as our families. We are in this together. And when we are pursuing the Lord together, we're able to say, yes, we are vulnerable, but the Lord is our provider. And I think about our passage for today. We're going to look at Exodus chapter 16, and we're going to kind of pick out some verses.
But we are looking at Israel as they have left Egypt. So they have made their way into the desert. And the people really knew vulnerability. In Egypt they were slaves. I have never known a slave that was not in a vulnerable position. You know, you think about the millions of modern day slaves across the world. They are all vulnerable.
The slaves in the slave trade they were vulnerable. They were taken advantage of by powerful people. So God has brought Israel through their vulnerability and slavery and brought them into the wilderness. Now, he's also done some really incredible things to show his power and show his might in how he brought them out. In the parting, the red Sea in the plundering of Egypt as they went.
And yet, in the midst of this, we still see a grumbling people that we'll see in the passage. But they look back to their time when they were enslaved and say it was better that and I think there's this in all of us. There's a tendency to look back to the past and say it was better then and long for and look for a time that maybe wasn't actually true.
So I'm going to go ahead and start reading off versus 1 to 5. And it says:
1 They set out from Elim, and all the congregation of the people of Israel came to the wilderness of Sin, which is between Elim and Sinai, on the fifteenth day of the second month after they had departed from the land of Egypt. 2 And the whole congregation of the people of Israel grumbled against Moses and Aaron in the wilderness, 3 and the people of Israel said to them, “Would that we had died by the hand of the Lord in the land of Egypt, when we sat by the meat pots and ate bread to the full, for you have brought us out into this wilderness to kill this whole assembly with hunger.”
4 Then the Lord said to Moses, “Behold, I am about to rain bread from heaven for you, and the people shall go out and gather a day's portion every day, that I may test them, whether they will walk in my law or not. 5 On the sixth day, when they prepare what they bring in, it will be twice as much as they gather daily.”

Spencer
You know, I think it's a beautiful passage and an amazing reminder of the way that God works, not just in Egypt and bringing the Israelites out, but also the reminder of how oftentimes we forget so quickly. Yeah. You know, I think about my own life. We had an event sequentially that I would so easily forget, and I was sitting down with a spiritual mentor, and he pointed this out through a series of questions because he had discerned this.
But we had a big question about whether we were going to adopt a child and ultimately became our our fourth child. And a few months later. But the Lord answered that question and said, without a doubt, move forward here in some ways through prayer. Well, one of my big questions was, will I have enough time to continue to run the firm while I have enough continued time to help grow the firm and do the things that I need to do to be a good teammate.
And when I came back from the retreat where I sensed the Lord's call, definitely to move forward with adoption, that was the best week of business we had ever had. And it was just remarkable the things that were put in place by the Lord. But I had forgotten within like two months the sequence. So I asked the question.
I had this reservation, the Lord spoke and then he blessed and I forgot within two months. So I can see myself in the Israelites in this because we see in the passage, God, of course, knows their needs, but He provides in a way that is so remarkable and so unconventional. And at the same time they have forgotten that he had done these miracles and yet they get out and he does something even perhaps more remarkable because he makes food out of thin air in manna.
And he brings in quail. You know, if you asked 100 of these Israelites when they're coming out of Egypt, how is the Lord going to provide food for you? There's not a one of them that's going to say manna.
They had no idea what manna was. You know, man. And basically translated means, what is it? So it's an unconventional way. But again, the Lord does provide in it and we kind of see ourselves, or at least I can see myself in this first part. So then we'll fast forward a few versus here. Let's go to Exodus 16:13 and following:
13 In the evening quail came up and covered the camp, and in the morning dew lay around the camp. 14 And when the dew had gone up, there was on the face of the wilderness a fine, flake-like thing, fine as frost on the ground. 15 When the people of Israel saw it, they said to one another, “What is it?” For they did not know what it was. And Moses said to them, “It is the bread that the Lord has given you to eat. 16 This is what the Lord has commanded: ‘Gather of it, each one of you, as much as he can eat. You shall each take an omer, according to the number of the persons that each of you has in his tent.’” 17 And the people of Israel did so. They gathered, some more, some less. 18 But when they measured it with an omer, whoever gathered much had nothing left over, and whoever gathered little had no lack. Each of them gathered as much as he could eat.

Austin
You know, as I look at this passage, this section we build off First God provides and then He provides exactly what they need. No more, no less. And it says some gathered more and some gather less. So God knew what each person needed. He was so intimately aware of each person's unique needs of each family's unique needs, so that, you know, couple of years ago it was just me, my wife, and we had one kid and then our daughter was born.
And then we adopted our son soon thereafter. A family of three with only one child under three years old is very different than a family of five. And having three kids under five years old. God knew our needs in both of those seasons and provided for them in what we needed. And he continues to show us that he will provide what we need.
And it is it is when we stretch and try to take control. Oftentimes those things get twisted. And I think just like you were saying, our propensity is just to forget what God has done. And I think about, you know, we fast forward an exodus later and the Israelites continue to grumble and they say, Moses, when are you going to get us more water?
And Moses has heard from God about how he is to get the water in Moses instead of doing what God says. He goes back to the first time that God provided water. And so not only do we struggle with this belief that God will provide, but sometimes when He provides an unconventional ways, in that instance, God said Moses, talk to the rock and it will put forth water.
I don't want to be the leader of a people yelling at a rock to pour forth water. And so I can be compassionate towards Moses in his unbelief, because I've been there in places where it's God saying, Do you trust me to provide Do you trust me that I am enough for you? And a lot of the times my attention is no.
And so what do I do? I try to grab and get more. So the next part, it highlights what happens when we do try to gather more than we need. And it says
19 And Moses said to them, “Let no one leave any of it over till the morning.” 20 But they did not listen to Moses. Some left part of it till the morning, and it bred worms and stank. And Moses was angry with them.
22 On the sixth day they gathered twice as much bread, two omers each. And when all the leaders of the congregation came and told Moses
27 On the seventh day some of the people went out to gather, but they found none. 28 And the Lord said to Moses, “How long will you refuse to keep my commandments and my laws? 29 See! The Lord has given you the Sabbath; therefore on the sixth day he gives you bread for two days. Remain each of you in his place; let no one go out of his place on the seventh day.” 30 So the people rested on the seventh day.

Spencer
And I think this really goes back to that point when we take control, when we disobey the Lord's direct guidance, we create problems. Some of those problems emerge immediately. And we see that here. We get worms. You know, the people get worms. It stinks. It's very visible.

Austin
When I've had maggots in my trash, it is disgusting. I don't want to eat that.

Spencer
So it, it not just corrupts that part, but it corrupts the entire landscape of their food. We see something that might be longer term though, and this is something that Israel really had to deal with over a long period of time. They didn't listen and they went out on the seventh day on the Sabbath. And there's not an immediate repercussion in this situation.
In that okay, well, they just spent an extra bit of time. They went out on the seventh day. There wasn't anything there. But it angers the Lord because they're not obeying and it kind of foretells what their future would be. And they're not taking Sabbaths, they're working the land, they're overworking, they're relying on themselves in so many different ways.
And this creates those long term problems that we see because there was enough. They went out, we could see on the sixth day they went out, there was twice as much there. They gathered twice as much. They were able to take that in and they had enough. But again, their temptation and our temptation is very similar in that they want to have some extra padding, some extra insulation from what might happen.
So do they really believe that the seventh day there would be none? Do they really believe that God is doing what he said he would do? Or maybe they think, Well, if we take it on the sixth day and we take twice as much, maybe we're going to get those worms that we got on the first day. But the Lord had arranged things where that was not the case.

Austin
It comes back to you whose story am I a part of? And if I believe I'm the central character of the story, then I'm looking out for me and I'm looking out for my family. And it's it doesn't matter what has been said. It is that if I don't do this, then something bad will happen. There's danger. Again, the Israelites were prone to remember their vulnerability.
They're in the wilderness. There's not a whole lot of things that they can easily find for food and for drink. And so they have to put their entire trust in the Lord. And I think there's kind of a twofold thing going on in the story is that they're in a place of vulnerability and they're forced to trust God, but they also have to choose to trust God as provider.
And so there's this dual tension of am I going to trust or am I going to try to make my own way? And then what happens when you don't is that God gets angry because he's given a way. And I just think we need to constantly wrestle with that tension of am I trying to make my own way? Am I like the people of Israel, and that I fear a dangerous world around me?
Or do I hope and the loving God that has always provided for me.

Spencer
Well, and I think of a story of a missionary who spoke with Emily and I one time about one of the greatest experiences for his family was they were missionaries in Africa. You're driving through in a rural area and their car breaks down and they don't know what to do. There's no nowhere anywhere nearby. But they had just talked with their kids about God being provider that morning.
And so the kids say, Well, Dad, shouldn't we be praying that God would provide for us? And the dad's like, Oh, yeah, I should we should be doing this. Okay, kids, let's pray. So he unpacked then all of the details of how the Lord provided the entire rest of that story. And now the kids all look back. You know, this is decades later, but they all look back and they say, well, that was a landmark trip because we learned about how to listen to the Lord depend on the Lord as our provider.
If they had just been able to go through that trip and have no interruption, they wouldn't have needed the Lord in the same way they would not have known the Lord in the same way. So that breakdown of the vehicle was God's instrument to allow them to know Him more deeply.
But so often we as parents, we want to just keep everything, you know, going, moving along and not have these moments where we feel so vulnerable and have to depend in a very visceral way, in a very practical way on the Lord.

Austin
For us in particular, a couple of months ago we had a Hackberry tree, a 70 foot Hackberry tree that just decided to start leaning. Then it started leaning a little bit more. And as we noticed, the Hackberry was leaning. We were like, We need to call and get this cut down. Well, it's the beginning of the year and it's just raining like crazy and the place in the house the tree was leaning towards, it was impossible to get back there.
And so the company that we call, they were like, well, we need a dry day. And it just wasn't a dry day. And they quoted us this bill and we were like, God, this is a really expensive tree bill Yeah, like thousands of dollars to get this tree taken down. We're like, God, you've been so generous and provided for us for so long.
And thankfully we have the cash and we're going to go ahead and book it as if we we're just going to continue to trust you will eventually. The tree started resting on the house, which was not good. But then God and his generosity and abundance provided through the insurance company to cover the cost of the tree and to repair the roof for where the tree decided to break through the roof.
And it's like I remember coming before the Lord and being like, God, what are we doing? Like, we have just given away a whole bunch of money at the beginning of the year. God, we know that you called us to do this, and now there's a tree on my roof. But in his generosity, it is abundant love he provided in a really surprising way of having a tree come down and thankfully not destroy the building, but just.
Just enough for him to continue to remind me I'm in control. You don't have to try to wrestle control away from me. I will take care of you. There was this really sweet reminder for me and my wife that but God does provide and sometimes it's in some really strange ways.

Spencer
So we look at that last passage there, verse 31.
31 Now the house of Israel called its name manna. It was like coriander seed, white, and the taste of it was like wafers made with honey. 32 Moses said, “This is what the Lord has commanded: ‘Let an omer of it be kept throughout your generations, so that they may see the bread with which I fed you in the wilderness, when I brought you out of the land of Egypt.’”
And so I think the final point that we would make here is God owns it all and it's not about us.
When we think about this story, we are small parts in the story. He's weaving this together and I love that this narrative ends here in 32 in the sense that the Lord's telling them, I want you to take a piece of manna and remember this because this is part of the story I'm weaving. So it's going to go far beyond you, far beyond your kids or your grandkids.
Even people are going to look back on this man and remember for all generations that this is what I did because this is my story. This is how I'm going to provide. This is going to be that very tangible reminder of what I did in creating food out of thin air for you because I am provider. So if we can come back to that and kind of anchor ourselves in that, then some of those questions that we pose, I think of when are you going to do this?
How are you going to do this when we remember God is provider and if he's creator and Redeemer, he can do some unconventional things when he needs to. So again, great conversation. I hope you enjoyed this. If you have questions, don't hesitate to reach out to us. And until next time, take care.