Ep. 067 - How Much Money Is Enough? Setting a Finish Line for Spending

Episode Transcript

Austin
As believers, we trust God to provide for our needs. When he provides in abundance, how do we honor God and respond to his generosity? Today we will be discussing finish lines for our spending.
So, Spencer, over the next couple of episodes, we're going to be talking about finish lines. In our last episode, we talked about budgeting, and we said that was kind of a foundational piece of our next few episodes. Today, we're going to address “income finish lines,” or another way to frame it is “spending finish lines.” So as God provides income, when we think about spending finish lines or savings finish lines;
what we're really saying is “when do we say how much is enough and how do we frame how much is enough when God provides?” And so when we think about as God brings in money on a month-to-month basis into our hands, how do we honor him with that? How do we say, “Man, God has provided more than I need for my living expenses, for my luxury and discretionary items that I've said enough to you?
What do I do with the rest? Do I just spend it? What do I do with that?” And so this is where we would say we're gonna cap our spending, and we're going to give more generously to the Lord. We're going to essentially cap that income to say “Everything I make over and above X amount, I'm not just going to spend it on myself or my desires.
I'm going to give it away to the Lord.” And that's how we're going to frame savings and with our heirs as well. Once we hit those goals, how do we then, with the Lord, participate in saying, “Okay, I have enough, my heirs have enough, or I have set aside what I think is going to be enough for my heirs.”
And then we say, “Okay, how do I be generous with the Lord, with charities, with the poor, with the rest of it?”

Spencer
I think in the midst of that, we want to say that “How much is enough?” is maybe the most provocative question because it comes back to God is steward [sic] God is owner, we are steward. And as we think about how much is enough, it's difficult to then put pen to paper and, and figure out our process of implementing this.
So with each one of these questions, we get a little closer to our implementation of saying, “Well, this is how I'm going to live out ‘How much is enough,” And particularly when he blesses us with a level of income.” There's different ways that we can go here and we'll unpack those. But we still come back to that key question of “How much is enough,”
And then ‘What do I do to make good on what God asks?”

Austin
And I think about this with Proverbs 3:9-10: “Honor the Lord with your wealth and the firstfruits of all your produce. And your barns will be filled with plenty, and your vats overflowing with wine.” Well, when God does that, then it doesn't just mean I get to eat it all and I get to drink it all.
I get to be a conduit of that grace, that I honor the Lord with that wealth by being a conduit of His grace with others, not just filling my barns fuller and fuller, for me to enjoy. Because as we've seen with our dangers of wealth series, unbridled accumulation or consumption or hoarding of God's resources is damaging to our souls, and it's damaging to your heirs, and to our community.
And I love this quote from Rachel Mcdonough's book, “True Treasure: Giving Savings and Spending According to Your Calling.” She says: “A lifestyle with no parameters will just expand to consume whatever resources are available.” So that's why we come back to this question of “How much is enough?” Because if we don't try to answer it; when wealth comes in, when income rises, when our savings multiply, then our natural tendency as humans is going to be “Okay, I'm going to increase my consumption to match that increase of income.”
And I'll be the first to admit this is right in front of my eyes. When income rises or gifts come in, or my family wants to bless me with something, I can be really greedy with that and say, “Man, I get to do more of what I want rather than my first thought being on “How can I be generous with the Lord?”
And so I'm always and often having to confess that greed to the Lord, and often having to come back and say, “God, help me, help me alleviate that tendency of ‘away from contentment and more towards myself.’ Help me turn my eyes back to you and your kingdom, because that is, that first tendency is ”Man, this is great,
God has blessed me. Therefore I get, therefore I get.” And I don't want to be a person that just says, “Therefore I get,” But I want to walk with the Lord in this. And so we really start to, and we have to begin with praying James 1:5: “If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask God, who gives generously to all without reproach, and it will be given to him.”
We have to come back and regularly be at our knees at the feet of the Lord, saying, “God, what do you want me to do with these things that you're putting in my hand?” And whether that's the actual income that comes in or your home or your vehicles, whatever it is, we need to be asking that in all contexts of life, of: “God,
how do I honor you with these gifts,” But I think especially with income and with our spending. And so we start with the conversation we had in our last episode about budget to really build on and say, “Okay, that kind of gives us a wider framing of, if we know what we're spending now, we can start setting some of those caps on, ”Okay,
when income rises to a certain extent, what do I do with the rest?”

Spencer
Right. And I think as we have a budget and we review that, one of the things that we can be mindful of is, “How do we view that? Are we thankful for what the Lord gives in that?” Because if He then gives us more income and we were already content, were already satisfied, we were already at a point where we were overflowing with praise to God;
then that income, it doesn't we don't take that and say, “Oh, it's all mine,” we're much more likely to be open-handed with it because we know our needs are met. Where I confess the same thing when there's more that comes in, I think, “Oh, gosh. Well, now I get to be able to do A, B, and C,” immediately rather than thinking, “Oh, all of my needs have already been met.
I've got it right here in the budget. So now how can we use those more strategically for God's kingdom?”

Austin
Well, as I think about this, when we think about, “Okay, if we're setting a finish line; let's say it's you currently make $100,000 a year and live comfortably. Your finish line doesn't need to be 150,000 a year.” Your finish line may be saying, “Okay, maybe I can live on 80 and give 20,000 away.” Maybe it's a reduction of the finish line.
Maybe you say, “Okay; at 100, I'm giving 10,000 already. If income rises to 110, okay, maybe on the next piece of that and maybe I give 15%, maybe I give 20%.” And so what we want to look at is; these finish lines, they don't necessarily need to be a hard stop where every dollar that comes in over and above that finish line that you and the Lord set together says, “Okay, I make 100; when it goes to 110, that ten just goes to charity.”
Maybe it's; the next a little bit, you tier it up, you give a little bit more, you give a little bit more over some of those excesses. But maybe for some of you, you say, “Hey, once that, once that hits, I've been living extremely comfortably.” And then it all goes to the Lord so we can say there's room and there's space for both [a] hard finish line and a soft finish line; where at some point with all of us, I think we would come to a place where if we're graduating our tithe; and this is that idea that as income rises, you give a greater allocation away,
at some point, we're all going to come to a place where we're going to have more than enough and we can give it all away. So there probably does need to be a hard finish line for everybody, but you can take time to get there.

Spencer
Right. Well I think that would be in line with wisdom if we just step back and said rationally, what happens if you get an extra $50 million? Well, okay, now you have all of these barns that you could fill up. It would put your soul in peril. We see that on lottery winners. We see all of the statistics push in that direction.
So if we if we add another 10, 15, $20,000; we are, we could have a graduated tithe like we're talking about. You know, I think Ron Sider was one of those that came up with that idea, many years ago in a book that he wrote, called “Rich Christians in an Age of Hunger.”
But just the recognition that there are a lot of things that the Lord's up to around the world; poverty alleviation, sharing the Gospel, all kinds of different things that, as we have more and more we can give progressively at a higher level, but still we need to be thinking about what is that ultimate cap above; and beyond which I'm really, it's not even so much that I'm that I'm trying to act strategically to build God's kingdom.
That is always true. However, I'm also putting my soul in peril when there's more and more and more; because anything that we look at scripturally, anything we look at in studies and surveys and statistics today, you see that the amount of wealth as it gets to some point, it leads people away. Not every person but you put your soul in harm's way.
You know, if you if you retain it. So that's why we kind of like this idea of, at least for some people, of an idea of a graduated tithe with some kind of a hard cap, you know, that's there. Because if the Lord blesses, we need to have decided this in advance, because the human heart is deceitful and can pull us back and say, “Oh, well, no, I, I could find a good way to be able to consume another, you know, 50% of my income that, I was already content with.”

Austin
Right, right. Okay. So let's come back to some practical ways that we can do this. So we'll talk about to you. We'll give some ideas of how you can actually implement this. So the first is a “Bottom-Up” method. And then the next two are going to be “Top-Down.” As we think about Bottom-Up, that's looking at our spending and going “Okay [what do] I need to meet my basic needs?
What do I have for discretionary lifestyle spending?” And all budgets really need to cover, make sure that you have enough to eat and have a place to sleep and have clothes to put on. When winter comes and you need a jacket, you need to have a jacket. I don't like walking around in thirty-degree weather in a t shirt and shorts.
So there are basic needs. Now, just like we talked about in our budgeting episode, your basic needs don't need to be extravagant basic needs. And so, take that into consideration with the Lord. But once you've kind of figured out, okay, maybe it's “I only need 4000 a month, and that covers all of my actual needs. It includes the discretionary things,
that includes the luxury things.” Okay well, if you make 5 or 6000 a month net on a month to month basis; okay, how do you participate with the Lord in saying, “Okay, what do I do with those extra thousand or two thousand dollars? Maybe it's ”Okay yeah; you add up a little bit more for some of those things that you enjoy, but maybe that's $500, maybe it's $200.”
And then the rest of it, you say, “Okay, God; where do you want me to utilize these resources?” But we're saying, “Okay, let's start off with that baseline. This is what I need on an individual basis on a month-to-month basis. And then you have that foundation. And then on top of that, everything [else is] ”Participate with the Lord, give with the Lord.”
So that's kind of how we think about a “Bottom-Up” method. And we'd say [sic] what ever method you use, you really need to come back and actually know what you're spending. We can't set finish lines, whatever they are, [sic] if we don't know where our starting line is.

Spencer
[Well and] those discretionary giving spots; they actually need to be things that bring us joy. And it should bring us joy to be able to help out, the poor or those in need, or to be able to share the Gospel with others, you know, and, such. But it needs to be something that we see that trade off and we say, “Oh, well, I could spend more or I could give,” it needs to be something that really draws our heart to be able to say, “Yes, I get to be able to do that.”
If it's not, then it, you know, if we're feeling like it's a “should” there, then oftentimes we get ourselves in trouble because we feel a level of resistance to make that gift. Now every person is going to look at this differently. But I've yet to sit down with somebody who, when they actually listen to the Lord, could not find anything that they did not enjoy giving to.
So sometimes that's just a lack of spending time with Jesus and hearing his heart of what are those things that are going to be, you know, those areas of discretionary giving that go above and beyond when we have that, you know, enhanced level of income.

Austin
Yeah. And there's some great videos that we'll put in the show notes from Generous Giving that talk about, “Okay, how do you actually look at where does the Lord want you to go?” They've got some really great resources; a talk they gave it one of their Celebration of Generosity conferences a couple of years ago that the woman said, this is what she does for her job, and she helps people discern where God wants them to give.
And so we'll link that in the show notes down below. So we've got our “Bottom-Up” method. The other way that we can think about this is kind of a “Top-Down.” And so we're going to use two different metrics here. It's either the federal poverty line or MIT has a living wage calculator. And what we're doing is instead of saying, “Okay, what are my personal needs?”
We say, “Okay, what are maybe some of the statistical needs, the median levels around me, and how do I base it, based on those other medians, or those other averages or benchmarks to say, ‘Okay, this is maybe what it cost to have a basic standard of living met in the geographical area that I live in.’” And so it's just kind of a good way, I think most of the time, because we don't have conversations with fellow believers about what we make that if I'm not having those conversations, then my benchmark is always going to increase.
And so I think having something, whether it's MIT or the federal poverty line guidelines, it helps have a standard benchmark. Now, obviously, we would say come back, have these conversations with fellow believers because then they can help you walk through; “Okay. Yeah, that's there. But let's remember what is actually true about your life right now, the stressors that you're on.”
And so we wouldn't say trade MIT or trade the US government for your church body helping you walk through this. But these are just kind of some ways that we can benchmark that.

Spencer
Well, then it can be really helpful because you can say, “Okay, well, if I'm a family of six and I've got, you know, both spouses working,” here's what kind of a minimum level, you know, might be from the research that MIT has done. That doesn't mean that you need to set your level there, you might say, well, you know, this this seems reasonable.
Plus another 20 or 30% or it's reasonable, but we're going to, you know, we spend a little bit more on the education for our kids. So we're going to you know, hold that, you know, different, something, there's ways that you can build from that, that still kind of anchor you to a level of, not allowing wealth to, take over the decision-making process.

Austin
Right, right. And so just kind of so y'all understand what those two metrics are: the federal poverty line; it's every year the US government sets it. And you can base it off family size. So that's how many people live within your household. And they've got rows of 1 to 14. And then percentages of federal poverty line. And so if you've got 14 people in your family (Lord have mercy haha) (...)
and if you're living at 100% of the federal poverty line, then they'll give you a annual rate for that. It's all based on three times of the cost of a minimum food diet from 1963, adjusted annually for inflation. So really, the federal poverty line is not meant to say this is what you can actually live on.
It's what's the minimum amount of food, the money that you need to spend on food, and a very bare minimum. It is not a level that I would say for anyone, “you should try to live at 100% of the federal poverty line.

Spencer
And let's be honest, that's not the food that you need for a 16 year old boy. No, no, it's, some other number.

Austin
Right. And the big difference here between the federal poverty line and the MIT study is that it doesn't adjust for geography. And so you're 100% of federal poverty line is going to be the same for New York City as it would be for Knoxville, Tennessee. And let's be honest: our rates, our standard of living, the cost to live here is very different than the cost of living in New York.

Spencer
Although with all the people moving here, it's starting to get more expensive. So, but good frameworks, there. Because again, it takes us out of just this, area where, we can't implement, where we can't really think about things, in a rational way, where we just say, “Well, our benchmark is only what we've done in the past or what we see somebody else doing.”
We perceive that because they drive this vehicle, they live in this neighborhood, they have these clothes or what have you, that they must be doing “this.” We never want those to be the central point that we come back to. Instead, things like this can be a help.

Austin
Yeah. And what I like about it is if you start to sense, “Okay, maybe the Lord is saying you can live at 250%, 300% of the federal poverty line.” Okay, maybe when a member of the household goes away; they're off at college, they're not dependent on you anymore, well, now I can just look at that table again and be like, “Oh, my family size is now four.
And I'm at 300%.” [these are some] ways that you can think about with the Lord. The nuance with the MIT living wage, and we'll put this in the description below as well; but the living wage calculator is, it was originally developed in 2003. And it's more comprehensive to estimate employment earnings or living wage that a full time worker requires to cover the basic needs based on geography.
So this is not going to be a great standard of living. It's going to meet your basic income needs. And so back to what you were saying. It's we're trying to think about “Okay, maybe my food is going to be a little bit higher because I want to give my kids maybe higher quality food,” or maybe it's “I want to send them to a better level of education,” or “maybe we have to spend a little bit more on X, Y, or Z.”
But again, what we can say here is that in Knoxville, a family of five where one parent works, one stays at home, you've got three kids. The living wage would be roughly $82,000 gross per year. But New York City, it might be 110 for that family of five. And so, again, that may not afford for you to meet all the desires and the wants that you have, but it gives you a benchmark to say, “Okay, based on the frameworks that they've done,
this would allow a minimum but adequate standard of living without reliance on public assistance.” So that's kind of just how we frame some of these two benchmarks. And so in either of those situations we would say, “Okay, whether it's a hard cap or a soft cap that you set; maybe you say, ‘Okay, I want my income to be a little bit more, maybe 120% of, the upper limit for that standard of living for myself,’”
Then maybe when your income rises above 98,000 or 100,000; if you're a family of five in Knoxville, maybe that means you start increasing that graduated tithe. Go from 10% 15 to 20; but you're just walking, again, we always have to come back to “I need to walk with the Lord because He is going to grant me the wisdom.
It's not my wisdom that I need to stand on. It's not the US government or MIT’s research.” Those are not the places where we find our joy and our contentment. We find our contentment in the Lord. So whether we do a “Top-Down” approach, whether we do a “Bottom-Up” approach to determine; “Where do I set spending limits, where do I set income limits?”
We have to walk with the Lord. If we're not walking with the Lord, we're just going to get muddled based on what I think is right.

Spencer
Well, and I love this discussion because we basically have to come back to the fact that we're stewards. And it's not ours, so we ask this question of “How much is enough.” Now, there's all kinds of different ways that we can get there. There's all kinds of different processes that you can use. But there needs to be something.
It doesn't need to be “Okay, I show up willy nilly to, you know, the mall or to this restaurant or to whatever, and, and I've not thought about what I'm, I'm going to do.” Because, again, I'm a steward. I'm not the owner of these funds. I need to be conscious of what the Lord is asking me to do.
Now, sometimes he's asking you to celebrate. Wonderful! Have that celebration. Take your wife out for a wonderful meal for your anniversary. Great. Celebrate your kid's birthday, whatever it might be. But at the same time, do it with intention. Because you're a steward. You're not the owner. So I think that's, you know, as we, as we talk through all these different details, all these different ways that we can come to it, you could come up with some entirely different way to go about this and be exactly in line with James 1:5 because you're listening to the Lord and you're acting as a steward. Just have that process, just have
that way that you're going about things so that you can walk with the Lord. You can participate with Him, every spending decision that you make.

Austin
Yeah. We want to finish there with kind of in line with what you're saying. But Paul's commendation in 1 Timothy 5:17- 19, we pray that this would be true of you: “As for the rich in this present age, charge them not to be haughty nor to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly provides us with everything to enjoy. They are to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share, thus storing up treasure for themselves as a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is truly life.”
We really hope that that would be true of you. Clients, if you want to talk about your spending decisions, your income, finish lines, we would love to have that conversation with you. Everyone else, feel free to leave comments down below. Visit us at secondhalfstewardship or seriousretirement.com, where you can book an appointment to talk with Spencer and I.
And on that, we'll see you next time. If you found this episode valuable, share it with a friend and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform so that you don't miss the next episode.

Disclosure
This content was provided by Second Half Stewardship. We are in Knoxville, Tennessee and you can visit our website at secondhalfstewardship.com. The information in this recording is intended for general, educational and informational purposes only, and should not be construed as investment, advisory, financial planning, legal, tax, or other professional advice based on your specific situation. Please consult your professional advisor before taking any action based on its contents.